Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7 : Apple Final Cut Pro Tutorial

Comments

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Shane Ross

"or is my solution to use a MTS converter program to get my 50p 422 files? "

That is your solution. FCP doesn't do 50p or 60p at 1080...only 720.

ClipWrap2 is the perfect solution.

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Shane Mason

I am trying to convert MTS files from a sony nex 5n.. In FCP, stuff shot at 25p converts fine, but I get error messages on the 50p stuff.. Is final cut not able to handle this? or is my solution to use a MTS converter program to get my 50p 422 files? cheers

@Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by lawrence Abbott

Awesome Job, Shane. Really cleared up alot for tapeless workflow.

My question is, what is the best/fasest way to edit. Having the scratch disk save onto the computer itself or to have the scratch disk be saved on the external hard drive that the footage is on. Always had this question for digital media.

Thanks for your tutorial.

Lawrence

www.mindtrippictures.com

@lawrence Abbott
by Shane Ross

Never put footage on your system drive. It is not fast enough for media.

For this workflow you need two sets of drives...one to store the camera backups, and the other for the Media...the CAPTURE SCRATCH drive.

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Jeff Dempsey

Hey Shane. Awesome tutorial. Although I am having the same problem as Austyn. It processes for a few seconds then gives me a "no data" error. It never transfers anything...

I'm trying to bring it in from my copy version on my drive, and directly from the card. same issue...

Any thoughts?

Thanks

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Ryan Whiting

Shane ~
I really appreciate this tutorial.
I am using FCP 6, so I don't have access to the ProRes 422 Proxy option, which is a bummer!

I recently shot a feature film on a Canon 7D, and we used the 60 fps feature of the camera quite a bit, intending that footage to play in slow motion when added to our 23.98 timeline.

Would you be willing to add on to this tutorial to explain the best way to conform a large number of clips to playback at a different frame rate so that: (A) you're not further compressing these clips by doing so, (B) you're not permanently altering your original clips, (C) the original clips can be imported (at ProRes HQ) for an online output?

There's a lot of different information out there about the best way to do this - using streamclip, cinema tools, compressor, etc - but I'm not clear on which is the most efficient, lossless, and easiest as far as relinking media from offline-to-online.

Thanks!!!

Ryan W.

@Ryan Whiting
by Shane Ross

"Would you be willing to add on to this tutorial to explain the best way to conform a large number of clips to playback at a different frame rate so that: (A) you're not further compressing these clips by doing so, (B) you're not permanently altering your original clips, (C) the original clips can be imported (at ProRes HQ) for an online output?"

Already done....

http://library.creativecow.net/ross_shane/slow-motion_cinema-tools/1

Sorry, but the Cinema Tools CONFORM does alter the footage...but doesn't compress them...or recompress them. Just takes the same frames and plays them back at a different rate. Want to have clips that play at 60fps and then duplicates that play at 23.98? Then simply duplicate all the footage first, then BATCH CONFORM the duplicates. You should add a custom name to them, like "(SloMo)" or something like that. Is there a simple, one button press process for this? No...this requires a little time and planning. But so does most of the editing tasks we do. But it doesn't take that long, or that much effort.

But wait...you want to bring in the files as ProRes PROXY...edit with that...make slow motion with that, and then relink to the HQ files? Well...simple. Do the slow motion on the HQ files first, then Media Manage them to Proxy. Then when you are done editing, take the PROXY files offline, put the HQ files online, and relink.

BTW...HQ is really overkill for Canon DSLR footage. The only difference you get between ProREs 422 and HQ is files that are 50% larger...take up 50% more space. If you color correct as ProRes 422, or HQ...the results will be exactly the same. Because HQ is meant for 10-bit files...like RED or ALEXA. Canon DSLR is 8-bit...so zero benefit by going to HQ over 422. Just because it sounds better doesn't mean it is.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD...don't miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

@Shane Ross
by Ryan Whiting

Thanks Shane ~
Awesomely clear easy to follow as always.

Appreciate it.

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Gordon Gurley

Shane, nice overview. Wondering if you have any advice for HXR NX5U users. When using FCP7, L+T crashes on long clips. Clipwrap seems ok, but what's the point then? I might as well go back to tape. FCPX?

@Gordon Gurley
by Shane Ross

Gordon...The NXCam camera records a form of AVCHD that FCP cannot address properly unless you update to 7.0.3. If you have done that, and STILL have issues, then you need to use ClipWrap.

The issue is that there is no AVCHD STANDARD. There is the AVCHD format, and then camera makers spin off their own versions of that. Panasonic AVCCAM, Sony NXCAM...etc.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD...don't miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Austyn Ellese

This is was great tutorial! I followed all the directions but I'm still getting an annoying "Error: No Data" msg when I load things into the queue. ANY idea what the heck I'm missing?

AE

@Austyn Ellese
by Shane Ross

When you load ANYTHING into the queue? Can you play the footage in the interface?

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD...don't miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

@Shane Ross
by Austyn Ellese

Hey Shane,

Yes it mounts and plays PERFECTLY in the interface... no jumps or skips or delay of play. but when I add it to the queue it will process for about 3 or 4 secs then stop, then give me the error msg... cant figure out why it won't pop into the bin...I've tried with multiple shdc cards with to avail. Is this where I should try the shotput software? I just really dont have the $100 bucks to spend at the moment...

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by andres garcia

Shane thanks for the tutorial. Is clear, but there is a bottleneck that I have not been able to solve, when I log and transfer the footage, it becomes huge, and there is not an affordable solution to storage so much things.

Andres Garcia
covisual.com

@andres garcia
by Shane Ross

Converting things like AVCHD to ProRes (a non-editing format to an editing format) tends to make the files larger. This is because the shooting format is so highly compressed, it doesn't lend itself to be edited...it's just too compressed.

Affordable storage solutions are everywhere. You can get a 2TB G-Raid for $250:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/650738-REG/G_Technology_GR4_2000_2TB_...

That holds a LOT of footage. 4TB one for for $430:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/650739-REG/G_Technology_GR4_4000_4TB_...

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD...don't miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by richard emerson

Hi, I also found this tutorial a great help, and was pointed to it after posting a question relating to Canon XF 305 ' Log and Transfer ' via their driver for FCP found on the Canon site...

I am experiencing a big problem, and that is if I select Apples Pro Rez( HQ ) I am not getting the same data rate that the Footage is shot in ie 50Mbps, the best I have managed is 22Mbps, I can see this by selecting the clip and then apple/cmd 9.

How can I maintain the 50Mbps for Broadcast as it's so Important?

Any help would be greatly received, once again thanks for the Tutorial....

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Hussein El Sherbini

this was extremely helpful :D however, my case is kind of different. i got some .mts files and i want to import them to final cut without having to go through any converters because i cannot afford to loose any quality :s I also have a Sony HD handy cam that records in AVCHD. so i was wondering, is it possible in anyway to import the material on the camera and transfer it through fcp? i know there will be the missing files that fcp needs to import the mts files, but is there a way to recreate those?

thanks :)

@Hussein El Sherbini
by Zak Ray

In my experience, you have to recreate the thumbnail file that tells FCP what to do. On Canons, this is located in BDMV > CLIPINF (whereas your MTS files are in BDMV > STREAM). The problem is that you can't use just any thumbnail, because it also dictates the clip duration; so in short, if you have a 10, 20, and 30 second MTS, you have to use your camera to record a 10, 20, and 30 second clip, find their thumbnails in CLIPINF, change their names to those of the MTS you're trying to import, and if the rest of the structure is there, it might work.

THAT SAID-- even if all of this is successful, you'll have to go through FCP's Log and Transfer, which forces a transcode to ProRes anyways. So why waste the effort?

@Zak Ray
by Hussein El Sherbini

honestly the only reason why i wanna go through the log and transfer is because its the only way i get my clips without interlace issues :s when i convert MTS to anything else it shows up badly interlaced on fcp... what would you recommend?

@Hussein El Sherbini
by Zak Ray

You're probably scaling them in some way when you convert. Whatever app you're using, make sure it's at the same resolution as you started with, and that you're telling it the correct frame rate and whether or not it's progressive.

I've used Toast to convert raw MTS before with decent results.

@Zak Ray
by Shane Ross

NO matter what, you need to convert. There is VERY little loss of quality when you convert to ProRes. If you don't have the full fire structure, then you can use ClipWrap2. It's really really good.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD...don't miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

@Shane Ross
by Hussein El Sherbini

i guess i'm gonna try and convert it again. to be honest, video really isn't my domain :s but thanks a lot, this was very helpful :D

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Al Bergstein

Great overview. While I have been doing L&T for a while, having just changed to MXF format camera, I thought I would review. I learned a thing or two. Great job.

Alf

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Cris Cazor

Thx, but I guess you don't understand what i mean, i just want to transfer part of the footage and not all of it to my HDD, so how can i do it, using the same folders and all the metadata contained in every folder?

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Cris Cazor

Hi guys, thx for the videotutorial, but how can drag some of the footage and not all of it to my Mac, i have 24Gb of footage but just want to use the last 8Gb of last night shooting, i haven't erased the old footage, because the camera is not mine and has something that doesn't belong to me, just borrowed this canon vixia from a friend.
Any solutions??

Thx again

@Cris Cazor
by Shane Ross

Difficult...as FCP needs the FULL card structure. Picking and choosing will disrupt that structure. You will either have to copy the full card and live with having the extra footage...chalk it up to expernience. Or import the files..convert what you want to ProRes, then discard that camera masters. But then back up your imports to two or three locations.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD...don't miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Shannon Bedford

Thanks Shane, very very helpful. I just wish I'd watched it before I started!

S Bedford, Western Australia
FCP 7.0.3, Mac OSX 10.6.6
2 x 2.8 GHz Quad-core Intel Xeon
6GM 800 MHz DDR2 FB-DIMM

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Zak Ray

The JVC files can be imported directly to the browser as they're MOV-wrapped. It's one of the selling points of the camera.

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Thomas Micah

Enjoys your instructional video. Am using JVC GY-HM100U camera. Unfortunately, it does not permit the log and capture that you highlighted in your presentation. Is it possible to do a log and transfer using the workflow you outlined? And can you do a presentation on this camera as Apple is promoting this as the camera to use with their FCS and many (including myself) are buying it for that reason? Thanks for your knowledge.

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Michael Kelly

Thanks for all your help :)

mike

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Dan Forsley

This tutorial is perfect for non intuitive people like myself. And Shane's voice is not all that 'droning' despite what he may think.

Thank you, Shane.

Dan

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Jason Jenkins

Thanks, Shane; I learned a few things!

Jason Jenkins
Flowmotion Media
Video production... with style!

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Tory Stewart

Hi Shane,

Thanks so much for this tutorial, I'm happy to have found it sooner rather than later. A question about reel/card naming conventions: I'm beginning work on a project that will likely involve a lot of footage shot over a few months so it seems prudent to include date info in the reel names. I was just wondering if you start over from 01 at the beginning of each shoot date or number the reels in continuous ascending numerical order from one day to the next? The latter seems to make more sense but I wanted to check rather than set myself up for media snarls down the line.

And on the subject of Browser organization: I have your "Getting Organized In Final Cut Pro" tutorial as well and have found it very helpful but I was wondering if you could give some tips on information you include in your browser columns for large documentary projects? Just trying to figure out the best way to indicate type of footage, location, scene etc to allow for easy browser sorting and make the best use of the customizable column headings.

Many thanks,

Tory

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Graham Cantwell

Great tutorial, thanks Shane.
Just finished a tapeless project and wish I'd had this beforehand, would have saved me a lot of trial and error.
Safe to say I've got it bookmarked for future tapeless adventures!
Thanks for taking the time to put it together.

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Allen Watts

This was a great tutorial, thanks for taking the time to put it together. We are in the process of standardizing on the Sony Z7U, which is an HDV camera that will record both on tape and CF at the same time. While this saves some time in the field, and creates a backup in real time, we've had some issues with the Log & Transfer process.

What we've landed on in the meantime is to L&T all of the footage, then separate the wheat from the chaff (as well as name clips, add log info, etc) in the FCP viewer window. Obviously, this is incredibly inefficient, especially for a tapeless "workflow" in the reality tv environment where we are recording terabytes of footage. We've called both Sony and Apple without any success.

Do you have any experience or advice for us? There is surprisingly little information out there on the interwebs about it. I keep thinking to myself (often out loud) "Surely someone else is having this problem..."

Thanks

@Allen Watts
by Zak Ray

I'm sorry, but did you actually say what problem with L&T you were having?

@Zak Ray
by Allen Watts

In the Log & Transfer window, you can see a list of HDV clips, but cannot view them, add log notes, in/out points, etc. Your only option (as far as i can tell) is to import 100% of your media

thx

@Allen Watts
by Zak Ray

Well according to this:
http://pro.sony.com/bbsccms/assets/files/micro/hdv/downloads/product_info_H...

You can't preview them. So perhaps Sony's use of L&T doesn't allow for trimming or logging either. Sound silly, but possible if Sony didn't put enough time into the plugin.

@Allen Watts
by Shane Ross

I don't have experience with that camera's tapeless format...sorry. That might bear some testing before you go out into the field and shoot. I did MONTHS of testing with P2 before we shot one frame. Well, the camera was yet to be released to the market at that time too.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD...don't miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Shane Ross

"Do you have to use 2 different drives to utilize FCP's offline editing?"

You have to with ANY tapeless format with ANY editing software. One drive is your ARCHIVE drive...the "source tape" if you will. Instead of tapes on a shelf, you have drives. Or, if you shoot a lot, then look into getting an LTO4 tape backup system. But no matter what, you need to archive the masters onto something. Then the OTHER drive is your MEDIA drive...where you store your actual converted media and you edit from.

"I have my original online ProRes footage and my ProRes (Proxy) compressed offline footage on the same drive. "

Ahh...the other way of doing this. Well, you don't need to have two separate drives then. Just make sure when you search for the full res footage to connect to, that you point FCP to a specific folder...instead of the whole drive like I demonstrate. Should work fine.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD...don't miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

Re: Tutorial: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Nick Meyers

hi Shane.
thanks for the great tutorial. it makes everything so clear!
i'll be recommending this to people i know who are starting to go down this path.

i'll confess i'm one of those people, too!

i'm currently about to import some footage from a 5D
and i have a question about re-naming the files.
you say that there is a unique identifier,
so changing the name in Log& Transfer is cool.
but how about AFTER transfer.
if the file names get re-named in the finder, (or in FCP, and modified to match in the finder)
will the unique identifier still work?
will FCP be able to re-transfer accurately?

thanks,
nick

Re: Tutorial: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Shane Ross

Yup. You can rename the clips, and use the RENAME FILE TO MATCH CLIP feature in FCP 7 and FCP will still be able to track the clip. I remember testing this out and then marveling at how good FCPs media management was...because it was supposed to be horrible.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD...don't miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

Re: Tutorial: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Nick Meyers

great! thanks, Shane.

nm

Re: Tutorial: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Craig Sawchuk

Thanks Shane, learned a lot but wish I'd had it a few weeks earlier. Just curious how AJA's Ki Pro and some of the other tapeless recording systems will fit into this approach?

Craig

Re: Tutorial: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Shane Ross

KiPro is already ProRes, already has clip and reel numbers. That format is truly direct DRAG AND DROP, couldn't be easier. As is the format recorded by the JVC camera that records direct to XDCAM EX Qt files.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD...don't miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

Re: Tutorial: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Graham Spice

Do you have to use 2 different drives to utilize FCP's offline editing? I have my original online ProRes footage and my ProRes (Proxy) compressed offline footage on the same drive. I've done all my edits with the offline footage and am now ready to relink. The file names match.

Is my only option to copy the offline footage to an external drive so FCP can't find it?

Thanks for the video tutorial and the help in the forums.

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Michael Locke

Shane, you're such a hero to us POOR, unemployed noobies, trying to break into this world of techmasters. Voices/shmoices, you actually THINK clearly so someone can follow the tutorial, and the content is so useful. NOTE! to other 550D/T2i owners: start the plugin hack from the Mac hard drive (it's Not in applications, which also has a library), and the "camera plist" is under the Resources folder (could only find "info plist" elsewhere). Thanks, someday I'll be able to afford your DVD's,but for now I'm getting back to work....ML

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Zak Ray

Nice tutorial Shane, but Sony does make an XDCAM L&T plugin.

http://pro.sony.com/bbsc/ssr/micro-xdcamexsite/resource.downloads.bbsccms-a...

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Shane Ross

Have you gotten it to work? I have installed it on FCP 6 and FCP 7 and I see no options for XDCAM in my Log and Transfer interface. Everyone I know, including Bunim/Murray that is ALL XDCAM, uses the Sony software. I have yet to get Log and Transfer to directly interface with XDCAM or XDCAM EX.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD...don't miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Zak Ray

Yeah, I've never had a problem with it. There's no preferences for it if that's what you mean, because your only option is to rewrap from the MXF (like P2 DVCPRO HD).

The Sony utility has a few more options (more so on the PC version, unfortunately), but for simple import, L&T has always worked for me.

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Shane Ross

Well...There you go. Because it didn't show up in the Preferences I didn't think it came in this way. I think I'll have to fix this tutorial now.

Thanks,

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD...don't miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Zak Ray

Yeah, EX only. I don't work with HD, but I assume you need the utility for that.

[Shane Ross] "I think I'll have to fix this tutorial now. "

Sorry! :)

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Shane Ross

NO! Good to know. That will be a minor fix. Thanks for the correction.

We can't know everything...

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD...don't miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Shane Ross

Now...is this only with XDCAM EX? Or does this work with XDCAM from disk too?

I THOUGHT I did this before via L&T. Dang...now I feel stupid. See, even us Leaders mess up at times.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD...don't miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Shane Ross

Tutorial fixed. Now mentions that you can use L&T for XDCAM EX. While I don't go into the specifics of XDCAM EX, the steps to get the footage into L&T, and the controls in L&T are all the same.

Thanks for the heads up Zak.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD...don't miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Zak Ray

You bet!

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Chris Tompkins

Nice job Shane!

Chris Tompkins
Video Atlanta

Re: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by John Livings

Thanks Shane, Great Tutorial.

John

Re: Tutorial: Tapeless Workflow with Final Cut Pro 7
by Michael Gissing

Excellent Shane. I will be sending a link to this to all my editor clients.

A technique that I have been using with 5D CF cards is to create an image file of the card to my RAID which I presumed also did a data checksum, before erasing cards.